Negative camber causing uneven tyre wear

[lagwagon]

Can someone explain to me how the camber is adjusted and what causes it to become negative?

I seem to have developed quite a bad negative camber over the last 3 years since i had a suspension upgrade and new BFG's fitted.
I thought it might of been due to the torsion bars sagging over time but i cranked them up and still the camber is very visible. like this /-\ with the passenger side worse. This seemed strange as the passenger side had been cranked up a lot more than the drivers side as the CV angle was much greater, too much for my liking anyway.
I already cranked the bars up a fair bit when i got them installed and ive also done the balljoint flip. I thought i mite have a bit of a positive camber after i cranked the bars but not at all.

So id like to know what i should do to rectify this problem, is it merely a quick visit to the tyre man for an alignment or is there more to it? I watched the guy align my front end when i got my tyres fitted and i didnt see him adjusting the camber, just the toe in/toe out side of things.
A couple of my ball joint boots have busted so ill replace them if it will help.

Thanks
Dan

[geeves]

It should be just a wheel alignment but a lot of tyre shops dont like messing round with shims. Go to a tyre shop that specialises in 4wds and talk to them about what is required and why. Expect to pay a little more as there can be a couple of hours sorting these sometimes.
Before takeing it in do disconect the sway bar and adjust the torrsion bars to be level and your desired hight then reconect the swaybar if your running one. This will solve some problems and make the alignment easier. Also give the 2 large nuts at the back of the pivot on the top A arm a good spray with crc a few days before doing.
How much lift have you got? A flip on its own alows for about 75mm tops of lift Beyond that you also need a spacer.
Other things that can affect this are bent arms or chassis or more likely worn bushes. These should be obvious to the wheel alignment man

[Yarno]

Behind the top a-arm there is shims that can be taken out, that's about all you have unless you lower the torsion bars or get the calmini arms...

[mulover]

Sounds like you could have lifted it too much, you may find you have to lower it a bit to get them back right, even if they remove all the shims. A spacer between the top ball joint/arm will definatley be a big help. the cv angles should be the same so, check it out with the sawy bar disconnected like geeves said.

[lagwagon]

Hi Mulover, so im wrong in thinking that the more you crank the torsion bars the greater the negative camber becomes?
Ive always thought that lifting the front end of torsion bar suspension increases the positive camber

Also what does disconnecting the sway bar do and is it difficult to reconnect?
Cheers
Dan

[nig99]

Hi Mulover, so im wrong in thinking that the more you crank the torsion bars the greater the negative camber becomes?
Ive always thought that lifting the front end of torsion bar suspension increases the positive camber

Also what does disconnecting the sway bar do and is it difficult to reconnect?
Cheers
Dan

The way the geometry of the front suspension works with the unequal length arms and staggered pivot points, the higher you go the more your camber goes
/-\.
So if you raise the outer end of the upper control arm reltive to the lowere arm it goes back to more like
|-|,
and you do this by doing your ball-joint flip, and/or putting in ball joint spacers.

Disconnecting the sway-bar takes all the stressout of the front end, and lets you level it up so its the same both sides - with the swaybar connected cranking one side up will actually lift the other side a bit

[lagwagon]

Righto, thanks guys its making more sense to me now.
Im going to disconnect the swaybar and bring the passenger side down to level it all up, make up some spacers for the balljoint and get a wheel alignment.
If the camber is still out then adjust torsion bars to correct. Sound about right?
Dan

[geeves]

Torssion bars only set hight. You need to remove shims to set the camber which has to be done on a wheel alignment machine. The ball joint flip and spacer is only so you can adjust camber befor you run out of shims.
Do get the mechy that does the alignment to check the A arm bushes before he starts

[lagwagon]

thanks Geeves
Would 5mm be ok for a spacer?
Has anyone done a template?
Thanks

[geeves]

5 would be ok I would go for 10 if you can. There is a catch though that hopefully if someone has a template it will help as the plate should be tapered and I cant remember which way. Otherwise the ball joint exceeds its design range of movement.
I wouldnt consider the spacer unless wheel alignment cant be set and there are no mechanical faults.

[jellis]

and I just did a search and found my answer. But will winding up the torsion bars more correct it or make it worse

Hey guys I just did a ball joint flip and replaced my joints and Now my tyres are \-/ any ideas how to correct this As I just brought new 33s and don't want them to wear un evenly
cheers josh

[geeves]

More shims will fix this but adjust to the correct height first. Raising the suspension will improve your situation but you need a full wheel alignment

[mudslinger]

to make the camber more postive shims have to removed from behind the top arm

[Yarno]

to make the camber more postive shims have to removed from behind the top arm

Correct, and for more info on which way positive and negative means...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camber_angle

[mudslinger]

shims are easy i do them all the time doesnt take that long people make out they are difficult to do but its basic as.